Activism Discussion: WTC Tower Explosion BEFORE 1st Plane Hit?

WTC Tower Explosion BEFORE 1st Plane Hit?
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Freedom Fighter
2007-01-22 18:16:17 EST
The following post (text below) to
http://z3.invisionfree.com/911debate/index.php?showtopic=119&st=30 dated
1/21/07 raises the issue of witnesses reporting an explosion in the basement
of one of the WTC towers BEFORE the first plane hit:
----------------
1) Name 1 instance of multiple, independant testimony of bombs going off in
an important and populous location, leading to injury and hospitalistion of
civilians, that has not only elicted zero investigation by authorities, but
has been actively whitewashed from public record by the government and the
mainstream media. ***NOTE*** I am NOT talking about the 9/11 Oral Histories,
damning tho that sordid saga is in itself, but the testimony of the
janitorial staff such as Rodriguez (plus David, Sanchez, Giambanco,
Pecoraro, and others) that there was a bomb taht went off in the basment
BEFORE the 1st plane hit. Note that there is video footage of David in
hospital, with severe burns on his face and body, talking about the bomb.
Give me one example, and then when you don't, tell me why you know more than
these people do.

2. Find me one independant opinion that WTC7 was not imploded [brought down
with demolition explosives]. I will give you several: Jowenko, Bachmann,
Schneider, as well as the engineers in the Scholars for 9/11 Truth, plus
articles contributed at www.journalof911studies.com.

--------------------------------
9/11 was an INSIDE JOB!

Patriotic Americans must demand that the new Democratic Congress open a new
and independent investigation.

9/11 - the IRREFUTABLE FACTS and the EVIDENCE backing them up:

WTC building 7 collapsed in a deliberate demolition by explosives just hours
after the collapse of the twin towers. There is no other credible
explanation for its collapse. The planes that struck the towers did not
structurally damage building 7, and debris did only minor damage to it. No
steel frame building has EVER collapsed from even a serious fire; the fires
in building 7 were not extensive, and were only on a few of the lower
floors. These probably were arson fires, as falling debris from the towers
would have only ignited the roof and upper floors. Deliberate, pre-planned
explosive demolition is the ONLY explanation for the sudden, complete, and
near free-fall speed collapse of building 7. This is the weakest link in the
official coverup - and the 9/11 Commission whitewash IGNORES building 7
entirely!

See documentation at http://www.wtc7.net/
and http://www.prisonplanet.com/012004watson.html

Explosive demolitions take considerable time to set up (see
http://science.howstuffworks.com/building-implosion1.htm).
The explosives could not possibly have been properly placed around all
thestructural supports and set up for detonation in building 7 in the few
hours between the attacks and that building's collapse. Yet that collapse
was clearly a professionally executed demolition by explosives.

Therefore -
THE DEMOLITION EXPLOSIVES IN BUILDING 7 WERE PUT IN
PLACE PRIOR TO THE PLANES IMPACTING THE TWIN TOWERS!

Therefore -
The 9/11 attacks were KNOWN OF IN ADVANCE, and DELIBERATELY
ALLOWED TO OCCUR! It was intended beforehand that building 7 and the twin
towers all be completely destroyed, KILLING THE THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE
REMAINING IN THEM! Is this anything less than mass murder, the crime of the
century aided and abetted if not perpetrated by HOMELAND terrorist traitors
to America?

The above facts, further documented below, do not alone rigorously prove
that previously placed explosives likewise brought down the twin towers, but
see the following:

A paper published by Steven E. Jones, Professor of Physics, Brigham Young
University, concludes that prepositioned demolition explosives brought down
all three collapsed WTC buildings, not the plane impacts or fires.

Consider these facts:

1. Pulverization of all three buildings:
As we all saw, all three buildings collapsed to DUST, with unusually little
solid debris remaining. It is clear that a 500,000 ton concrete and steel
building cannot be turned to a huge cloud of dust in less than 15 seconds by
a simple structural collapse, nor indeed by anything other than explosives.

2. Thermate residue in the metal:
Professor Jones of Brigham Young University has tested the metal taken from
the site, and a paper on his findings is available
(http://www.journalof911studies.com/ or video at
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-2842384983834100001&q=stephen+jones
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...=stephen+jones

The debris has tested positive for products of a THERMATE REACTION. Thermate
is an incediary substance used to very quickly slice through thick steel. It
is used together with high explosives in controlled demolitions.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=WrCWLpRc1yM
Professor Jones's findings have been scrutinized since June 2006 and are
scientifically undisputed. They prove on their own that this was an inside
job, as thermate could not have been present through any other
circumstances.

3. Free fall collapses:
The towers fell, according to the 9/11 Commission, at 9-10 seconds, and 7
for WTC7. This equates to almost free fall speed. The only way an object can
free fall is if it encounters no more resistance in its fall than air. This
cannot happen in a structural collapse, as the floors would pancake on top
of one another, resulting in about 90 major points of inertial resistance to
the fall. Free fall can only happen in a controlled demolition where all the
supports are blown out at once or close to it, and the structures below the
falling matter can offer little or no resistance.
Check out Dutch controlled demolition expert Danny Jowenko's statement on
this:
http://www.911blogger.com/node/3231]http://www.911blogger.com/node/3231

4. Eyewitness reports:
Shortly after 9/11, the FDNY recorded over 500 oral histories in which
firefighters and emergency medical workers recounted their experiences of
that day. Mayor Bloomberg's administration, however, has refused to release
them. But the New York Times, joined by several families of 9/11 victims,
filed suit and, after a long process, the New York Court of Appeals ordered
the city to release the bulk of these oral histories, which it did in August
2005. The Times then made them publicly available
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/html/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/met_WTC_histories_full_01.html

These oral histories contain many dozens of testimonies that speak of
explosions and related phenomena characteristic of controlled demolition.

Some examples:

Several individuals reported that they witnessed an explosion just before
one of the towers collapsed. Battalion Chief John Sudnik said: "we heard . .
. what sounded like a loud explosion and looked up and I saw tower two start
coming down" (NYT, Sudnick, p. 4).

Several people reported multiple explosions. Paramedic Kevin Darnowski said:
"I heard three explosions, and then . . . tower two started to come down"
(NYT, Darnowski, p. 8).

Firefighter Thomas Turilli said, "it almost sounded like bombs going off,
like boom, boom, boom, like seven or eight" (NYT, Turilli, p. 4). Craig
Carlsen said that he and other firefighters "heard explosions coming from .
. . the south tower. . . . There were about ten explosions. . . . We then
realized the building started to come down" (NYT, Carlsen, pp. 5-6).

Firefighter Joseph Meola said, "it looked like the building was blowing out
on all four sides. We actually heard the pops" (NYT, Meola, p. 5).

Paramedic Daniel Rivera also mentioned "pops." Asked how he knew that the
south tower was coming down, he said: "It was a frigging noise. At first I
thought it was---do you ever see professional demolition where they set the
charges on certain floors and then you hear 'Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop'? . . .
I thought it was that." (NYT, Rivera, p. 9)

Timothy Burke said that "the building popped, lower than the fire. . . . I
was going oh, my god, there is a secondary device because the way the
building popped. I thought it was an explosion" (NYT, Burke, pp. 8-9).

Firefighter Edward Cachia said: "It actually gave at a lower floor, not the
floor where the plane hit. . . . [W]e originally had thought there was like
an internal detonation, explosives, because it went in succession, boom,
boom, boom, boom, and then the tower came down" (NYT, Cachia, p. 5).

Some of the witnesses spoke of flashes and of phenomena suggestive of
demolition rings:

Assistant Commissioner Stephen Gregory said: "I thought . . . before . . .
No. 2 came down, that I saw low-level flashes. . . . I . . . saw a flash
flash flash . . . [at] the lower level of the building. You know like when
they demolish a building?" (NYT, Gregory, pp. 14-16).

Further evidence can be found at:
http://www.attackonamerica.net/proofofcontrolleddemolitionatwtc.htm This
author has a master's degree in Engineering from Stanford University, and a
Ph.D. in Psychology from the University of Oregon.

MORE EVIDENCE OF THERMATE-EXPLOSIVE DEMOLITION:

There were severalthousand pounds of still red-hot molten iron found under
the three collapsed WTC buildings six weeks after the cleanup began. When
metal is heated to over 3500 degrees F in a matter of seconds, and a piece
falls away, it is effectively cut just as with an oxy-acetylene torch. This
is how thermate is used to cut through steel from a safe distance.
Demolition crews use it in conjunction with C-4 explosive "kicker" charges.
Initiate the thermite by remote control, wait 12 seconds or so, then
detonate the C-4 to "kick" the column or post away from its severed support.

History can be rewritten, but the laws of physics cannot. Jet fuel can only
reach about 1100 degrees F, nowhere near the temperature required to create
a pool of molten iron slag. That only happens at thermate reaction
temperatures. Thermate is a simple substance, made mostly of aluminum and
iron oxide. When the reaction takes place, the iron oxide and aluminum
become aluminum oxide and white-hot molten iron at a temperature of about
4500 F. Thermate requires at least 1400 degrees F to start its exothermic
reaction, so you cannot ignite thermate by crashing an airplane into a
building. And even if that were possible, how did the thermate get there in
the first place, positioned to sever steel structural members?

EVEN MORE EVIDENCE of the inside job:

Many very small HUMAN BODY FRAGMENTS have been found on the roofs of nearby
buildings. These were too far away to be from jumpers from the towers. If
the towers simply collapsed from damage and fire, what blew these bodies to
smithereens and sent the fragments flying for considerable distances? The
plane impacts did not have the explosive brisance (shattering force)
necessary to do this - only HIGH EXPLOSIVES, like C-4, can blow bodies to
tiny bits.

In addition, consider THE TOTAL FAILURE of our sophisticated NORAD AEROSPACE
DEFENSE SYSTEM. Not even ONE of the FOUR hijacked jets flying at SUBSONIC
speeds towards known terrorist targets was intercepted! Such a failure could
not have happened without it being intentional. Military exercises were
underway at the time that would make reports of hijacked planes appear to be
merely part of the exercise. The attempts at official explanation for this
inexplicable failure have been uniformly ludicrous.

Possible motives? Do a Google search on the "Project For a New American
Century," and the "New Pearl Harbor."

Many deniers of these unprecedented crimes of mass murder are simply
psychologically incapable of considering them possible. Misled by the
corporate/government-controlled media, deceived by an elaborate cover-up,
and indoctrinated with a perverted sense of "patriotism," they are under the
delusion that only barbaric foreign terrorists could commit such inhuman
atrocities. But foreign terrorists could not have planted demolition
explosives in advance. HOMELAND TERRORISTS had to do that! The implications
of this are literally unthinkable to many, which is just what the evil
perpetrators of this crime against humanity are counting on.

Given the shock and horror, the massive death and destruction of these
events, irrational denial is understandable. History reveals despicable acts
of terror by unscrupulous powers in the USSR, Germany, China, and elsewhere.
Why would this evil side of human nature not surface here in America?

Overcoming denial and exposing the truth is the only hope for saving us from
a fascist regime of vicious killers as bad as the Nazis ever were. Should we
wait to find out if they can be even worse?

CONTACT YOUR REPRESENTATIVES IN CONGRESS AND THE SENATE.
DEMAND A NEW AND INDEPENDENT INVESTIGATION OF THIS MASS-MURDEROUS CRIME OF
THE CENTURY!

More 9/11 documentation:
http://www.st911.org/
http://www.septembereleventh.org/kc/multimedia/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEJmcvTzYfo&NR
http://911busters.com/911-Commission.html
http://www.septembereleventh.org/audio.php
http://911busters.com/SanFran04/index.html
http://www.911truth.org/index.php?topic=gallery
http://www.reopen911.org/
http://www.911truth.org/
http://www.911truthseekers.org/
http://www.911truthseekers.org/modules/news/
http://www.gnn.tv/
http://www.fema.gov/pdf/library/fema403_apc.pdf
http://www.911studies.com/index.html
http://www.septembereleventh.org/index.php
http://infowars.com/
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/
http://www.mujca.com/index.htm
http://proliberty.com/observer/20051213.htm
http://911research.wtc7.net/index.html
http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html
http://911review.com/
http://guardian.250free.com/wtc/dust-cloud.htm
http://www.defenselink.mil/transcripts/2001/t11182001_t1012pm.html
------------------------
The Truth About September 11th
>From 23 Informative Websites
Lovearth.net Has Put Together 23 Informative Websites
To Help You Educate Yourself About This "War On Terror"

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Published October 22, 2001 http://www.MyCountryRightOrWrong.net

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"You can fool some of the people all the time,
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you want to concentrate on".
http://en.thinkexist.com/quotes/george_w._bush/



Danny Burstein
2007-01-22 18:47:01 EST
[ full snip ]

Hey, Feedom Fighter. Here's a quarter. Use it
to go to the payphne at the corner and call
your answering machine at home. THat way
at least you'll be able to pretend that
someone's calling you.


--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
d*b@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

Animal05
2007-01-22 18:50:43 EST
Reality Fighter wrote:
> The following post (text below) to
> http://z3.invisionfree.com/911debate/index.php?showtopic=119&st=30 dated
> 1/21/07 raises the issue of witnesses reporting an explosion in the basement
> of one of the WTC towers BEFORE the first plane hit:

>

<same old same old debunked kook crap snipped>

Still fighting against reality, I see.

Cameltoe Johnson
2007-01-22 19:06:19 EST
On 2007-01-22 18:16:17 -0500, "Freedom Fighter" <liberty@once.net> said:

> The following post (text below) to
> http://z3.invisionfree.com/911debate/index.php?showtopic=119&st=30
> dated 1/21/07 raises the issue of witnesses reporting an explosion in
> the basement of one of the WTC towers BEFORE the first plane hit:


C'mon man, stop, JUST STOP. It's fucking REDICULOUS.

God almight are you people REALLY that stupid???? Really?



A*@justicespammail.com
2007-01-22 20:13:33 EST
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 23:16:17 GMT, "Freedom Fighter" <liberty@once.net>
wrote:

>The following post (text below) to
>http://z3.invisionfree.com/911debate/index.php?showtopic=119&st=30 dated
>1/21/07 raises the issue of witnesses reporting an explosion in the basement
>of one of the WTC towers BEFORE the first plane hit:
>----------------
>1) Name 1 instance of multiple, independant testimony of bombs going off in
>an important and populous location, leading to injury and hospitalistion of
>civilians, that has not only elicted zero investigation by authorities, but
>has been actively whitewashed from public record by the government and the
>mainstream media. ***NOTE*** I am NOT talking about the 9/11 Oral Histories,
>damning tho that sordid saga is in itself, but the testimony of the
>janitorial staff such as Rodriguez (plus David, Sanchez, Giambanco,
>Pecoraro, and others) that there was a bomb taht went off in the basment
>BEFORE the 1st plane hit. Note that there is video footage of David in
>hospital, with severe burns on his face and body, talking about the bomb.

Wasn't David the one that was in the elevator?

>Give me one example, and then when you don't, tell me why you know more than
>these people do.

Because I'm not out to make a buck.

>2. Find me one independant opinion that WTC7 was not imploded [brought down
>with demolition explosives]. I will give you several: Jowenko, Bachmann,
>Schneider, as well as the engineers in the Scholars for 9/11 Truth, plus
>articles contributed at www.journalof911studies.com.

I thought you wanted an INDEPENDENT opinion. I guess you lied.

Vandar
2007-01-22 21:36:02 EST
Cameltoe Johnson wrote:

> On 2007-01-22 18:16:17 -0500, "Freedom Fighter" <liberty@once.net> said:
>
>> The following post (text below) to
>> http://z3.invisionfree.com/911debate/index.php?showtopic=119&st=30
>> dated 1/21/07 raises the issue of witnesses reporting an explosion in
>> the basement of one of the WTC towers BEFORE the first plane hit:
>
>
>
> C'mon man, stop, JUST STOP. It's fucking REDICULOUS.
>
> God almight are you people REALLY that stupid???? Really?

Most of them are.


SHOOTER586
2007-01-22 23:13:12 EST

Freedom Fighter wrote:
> but the testimony of the
> janitorial staff such as Rodriguez (plus David, Sanchez, Giambanco,
> Pecoraro, and others) that there was a bomb taht went off in the basment
> BEFORE the 1st plane hit.

How did they know it was before the plane hit? Wasn't there a time
difference between the level of impact and the basement?

Note that there is video footage of David in
> hospital, with severe burns on his face and body, talking about the bomb.
> Give me one example, and then when you don't, tell me why you know more than
> these people do.

He had burns from a flammable liquid, such as jet fuel.

> 2. Find me one independant opinion that WTC7 was not imploded [brought down
> with demolition explosives]. I will give you several: Jowenko, Bachmann,
> Schneider, as well as the engineers in the Scholars for 9/11 Truth, plus
> articles contributed at www.journalof911studies.com.

"scholars" for "truth" is independant? How many theology professors are
out to sell a book or video? Did any of them consult actual experts? Or
are they making perception judgements?

> --------------------------------
> 9/11 was an INSIDE JOB!

Whatever!

> Patriotic Americans must demand that the new Democratic Congress open a new
> and independent investigation.
>
> 9/11 - the IRREFUTABLE FACTS and the EVIDENCE backing them up:

Irrefutable, yet you can't answer specific questions.

> WTC building 7 collapsed in a deliberate demolition by explosives just hours
> after the collapse of the twin towers.

Sounds like a fact.

> There is no other credible explanation for its collapse.

Now sounds like a guess.

> The planes that struck the towers did not
> structurally damage building 7, and debris did only minor damage to it.

Yet, 100's of firefighters disagree with you.

> No steel frame building has EVER collapsed from even a serious fire; the fires
> in building 7 were not extensive, and were only on a few of the lower
> floors. These probably were arson fires, as falling debris from the towers
> would have only ignited the roof and upper floors. Deliberate, pre-planned
> explosive demolition is the ONLY explanation for the sudden, complete, and
> near free-fall speed collapse of building 7. This is the weakest link in the
> official coverup - and the 9/11 Commission whitewash IGNORES building 7
> entirely!

WTC 7 wasn't in the scope of the investigation

> See documentation at http://www.wtc7.net/
> and http://www.prisonplanet.com/012004watson.html
>
> Explosive demolitions take considerable time to set up (see
> http://science.howstuffworks.com/building-implosion1.htm).
> The explosives could not possibly have been properly placed around all
> thestructural supports and set up for detonation in building 7 in the few
> hours between the attacks and that building's collapse. Yet that collapse
> was clearly a professionally executed demolition by explosives.

They also leave a little residue.

> Therefore -
> THE DEMOLITION EXPLOSIVES IN BUILDING 7 WERE PUT IN
> PLACE PRIOR TO THE PLANES IMPACTING THE TWIN TOWERS!

Yet none of them exploded during the fires. Interesting!

> Therefore -
> The 9/11 attacks were KNOWN OF IN ADVANCE, and DELIBERATELY
> ALLOWED TO OCCUR! It was intended beforehand that building 7 and the twin
> towers all be completely destroyed, KILLING THE THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE
> REMAINING IN THEM! Is this anything less than mass murder, the crime of the
> century aided and abetted if not perpetrated by HOMELAND terrorist traitors
> to America?

That is your basis for a so-called fact?

> The above facts, further documented below, do not alone rigorously prove
> that previously placed explosives likewise brought down the twin towers, but
> see the following:
>
> A paper published by Steven E. Jones, Professor of Physics, Brigham Young
> University, concludes that prepositioned demolition explosives brought down
> all three collapsed WTC buildings, not the plane impacts or fires.

Fired for violating peer-review standards after several warnings.
Interesting!

> Consider these facts:
>
> 1. Pulverization of all three buildings:
> As we all saw, all three buildings collapsed to DUST, with unusually little
> solid debris remaining. It is clear that a 500,000 ton concrete and steel
> building cannot be turned to a huge cloud of dust in less than 15 seconds by
> a simple structural collapse, nor indeed by anything other than explosives.

Little solid debris?, yet we all saw it trucked away. Interesting! If
you drop concrete on the ground, it crumbles, yet when you generate
billions of Joules of energy during a collapse, it should damage the
concrete? Intersting!

> 2. Thermate residue in the metal:
> Professor Jones of Brigham Young University has tested the metal taken from
> the site, and a paper on his findings is available
> (http://www.journalof911studies.com/ or video at
> http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-2842384983834100001&q=stephen+jones
> http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...=stephen+jones

Only a few elements found. Not really conclusive of anything other than
sulphur and iron. Drywall and jet fuel have sulphur and the building
was made with iron. Intersting!

> The debris has tested positive for products of a THERMATE REACTION. Thermate
> is an incediary substance used to very quickly slice through thick steel. It
> is used together with high explosives in controlled demolitions.
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=WrCWLpRc1yM
> Professor Jones's findings have been scrutinized since June 2006 and are
> scientifically undisputed. They prove on their own that this was an inside
> job, as thermate could not have been present through any other
> circumstances.

Can think of ANY demolition project that was done with thermite?
Neither can I.

> 3. Free fall collapses:
> Free fall can only happen in a controlled demolition where all the
> supports are blown out at once or close to it, and the structures below the
> falling matter can offer little or no resistance.
> Check out Dutch controlled demolition expert Danny Jowenko's statement on
> this:
> http://www.911blogger.com/node/3231]http://www.911blogger.com/node/3231

How did you determine this? A guess, or did you contact demolition
contractors?

> 4. Eyewitness reports:
> Shortly after 9/11, the FDNY recorded over 500 oral histories in which
> firefighters and emergency medical workers recounted their experiences of
> that day. Mayor Bloomberg's administration, however, has refused to release
> them. But the New York Times, joined by several families of 9/11 victims,
> filed suit and, after a long process, the New York Court of Appeals ordered
> the city to release the bulk of these oral histories, which it did in August
> 2005. The Times then made them publicly available
> http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/html/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/met_WTC_histories_full_01.html

> These oral histories contain many dozens of testimonies that speak of
> explosions and related phenomena characteristic of controlled demolition.

But no explosives. Intersting!

> Some examples:
>
> Several individuals reported that they witnessed an explosion just before
> one of the towers collapsed. Battalion Chief John Sudnik said: "we heard [edit for content that makes freedom fighter look stupid] what sounded like a loud explosion and looked up and I saw tower two start
> coming down" (NYT, Sudnick, p. 4).
>
> Several people reported multiple explosions. Paramedic Kevin Darnowski said:
> "I heard three explosions, and then [edit] tower two started to come down"
> (NYT, Darnowski, p. 8).
>
> Firefighter Thomas Turilli said, "it almost sounded like bombs going off,
> like boom, boom, boom, like seven or eight" (NYT, Turilli, p. 4). Craig
> Carlsen said that he and other firefighters "heard explosions coming from .
> . . the south tower. . . . There were about ten explosions. . . . We then
> realized the building started to come down" (NYT, Carlsen, pp. 5-6).

What was editted out there?

> Firefighter Joseph Meola said, "it looked like the building was blowing out
> on all four sides. We actually heard the pops" (NYT, Meola, p. 5).
>
> Paramedic Daniel Rivera also mentioned "pops." Asked how he knew that the
> south tower was coming down, he said: "It was a frigging noise. At first I
> thought it was---do you ever see professional demolition where they set the
> charges on certain floors and then you hear 'Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop'? . . .
> I thought it was that." (NYT, Rivera, p. 9)
>
> Timothy Burke said that "the building popped, lower than the fire. . . . I
> was going oh, my god, there is a secondary device because the way the
> building popped. I thought it was an explosion" (NYT, Burke, pp. 8-9).

What was editted out there?

> Firefighter Edward Cachia said: "It actually gave at a lower floor, not the
> floor where the plane hit. . . . [W]e originally had thought there was like
> an internal detonation, explosives, because it went in succession, boom,
> boom, boom, boom, and then the tower came down" (NYT, Cachia, p. 5).

What was editted out there?

> Some of the witnesses spoke of flashes and of phenomena suggestive of
> demolition rings:

I thought you didn't know what "demolition rings" were? How can you say
this is what they were referring?

> Assistant Commissioner Stephen Gregory said: "I thought . . . before . . .
> No. 2 came down, that I saw low-level flashes. . . . I . . . saw a flash
> flash flash . . . [at] the lower level of the building. You know like when
> they demolish a building?" (NYT, Gregory, pp. 14-16).

What was editted out there?

> Further evidence can be found at:
> http://www.attackonamerica.net/proofofcontrolleddemolitionatwtc.htm This
> author has a master's degree in Engineering from Stanford University, and a
> Ph.D. in Psychology from the University of Oregon.
>
> MORE EVIDENCE OF THERMATE-EXPLOSIVE DEMOLITION:
>
> There were severalthousand pounds of still red-hot molten iron found under
> the three collapsed WTC buildings six weeks after the cleanup began. When
> metal is heated to over 3500 degrees F in a matter of seconds, and a piece
> falls away, it is effectively cut just as with an oxy-acetylene torch. This
> is how thermate is used to cut through steel from a safe distance.
> Demolition crews use it in conjunction with C-4 explosive "kicker" charges.
> Initiate the thermite by remote control, wait 12 seconds or so, then
> detonate the C-4 to "kick" the column or post away from its severed support.

How do you know thermite can keep its heat after burning out? Do you
have any anaysis of this?

> History can be rewritten, but the laws of physics cannot. Jet fuel can only
> reach about 1100 degrees F, nowhere near the temperature required to create
> a pool of molten iron slag. That only happens at thermate reaction
> temperatures. Thermate is a simple substance, made mostly of aluminum and
> iron oxide. When the reaction takes place, the iron oxide and aluminum
> become aluminum oxide and white-hot molten iron at a temperature of about
> 4500 F. Thermate requires at least 1400 degrees F to start its exothermic
> reaction, so you cannot ignite thermate by crashing an airplane into a
> building. And even if that were possible, how did the thermate get there in
> the first place, positioned to sever steel structural members?

That is the only case? Interesting!

> EVEN MORE EVIDENCE of the inside job:
>
> Many very small HUMAN BODY FRAGMENTS have been found on the roofs of nearby
> buildings. These were too far away to be from jumpers from the towers. If
> the towers simply collapsed from damage and fire, what blew these bodies to
> smithereens and sent the fragments flying for considerable distances? The
> plane impacts did not have the explosive brisance (shattering force)
> necessary to do this - only HIGH EXPLOSIVES, like C-4, can blow bodies to
> tiny bits.

Too far for pieces of humans jumping. I wouldn't think human debris can
jump.

> In addition, consider THE TOTAL FAILURE of our sophisticated NORAD AEROSPACE
> DEFENSE SYSTEM. Not even ONE of the FOUR hijacked jets flying at SUBSONIC
> speeds towards known terrorist targets was intercepted! Such a failure could
> not have happened without it being intentional. Military exercises were
> underway at the time that would make reports of hijacked planes appear to be
> merely part of the exercise. The attempts at official explanation for this
> inexplicable failure have been uniformly ludicrous.

NORAD caused the buildings to collapse?

> Possible motives? Do a Google search on the "Project For a New American
> Century," and the "New Pearl Harbor."

You can always count on PNAC making an appearance.

> Many deniers of these unprecedented crimes of mass murder are simply
> psychologically incapable of considering them possible.

Or just don't beklieve in fairy tales with zero evidence.


Ed
2007-01-22 23:35:06 EST

Vandar wrote:
> Cameltoe Johnson wrote:
>
> > On 2007-01-22 18:16:17 -0500, "Freedom Fighter" <liberty@once.net> said:
> >
> >> The following post (text below) to
> >> http://z3.invisionfree.com/911debate/index.php?showtopic=119&st=30
> >> dated 1/21/07 raises the issue of witnesses reporting an explosion in
> >> the basement of one of the WTC towers BEFORE the first plane hit:
> >
> >
> >
> > C'mon man, stop, JUST STOP. It's fucking REDICULOUS.
> >
> > God almight are you people REALLY that stupid???? Really?
>
> Most of them are.

You ever read Larry Niven's "Inferno"? There's a sequence where a
person in Hell has to pump a bicycle to keep a factory from pumping
pollution. It comes out that he worked against an actual "clean"
nuclear power plant because he was the head of the protesting
organization and if he stopped because his protest was no longer valid,
he wouldn't have any visibility at all!

It's similar, if you stop and think about it.


P*@gmail.com
2007-01-22 23:52:15 EST

Cameltoe Johnson wrote:
> On 2007-01-22 18:16:17 -0500, "Freedom Fighter" <liberty@once.net> said:
>
> > The following post (text below) to
> > http://z3.invisionfree.com/911debate/index.php?showtopic=119&st=30
> > dated 1/21/07 raises the issue of witnesses reporting an explosion in
> > the basement of one of the WTC towers BEFORE the first plane hit:
>
>
> C'mon man, stop, JUST STOP. It's fucking REDICULOUS.
>
> God almight are you people REALLY that stupid???? Really?

Squawk! Ad-hominem attack is the refuge of unintelligent... Squawk!
Reality Fighter


Vandar
2007-01-22 23:55:49 EST
SHOOTER586 wrote:

>>Firefighter Thomas Turilli said, "it almost sounded like bombs going off,
>>like boom, boom, boom, like seven or eight" (NYT, Turilli, p. 4). Craig
>>Carlsen said that he and other firefighters "heard explosions coming from .
>>. . the south tower. . . . There were about ten explosions. . . . We then
>>realized the building started to come down" (NYT, Carlsen, pp. 5-6).
>
>
> What was editted out there?

Not only was much edited out, sentences were outright changed.
The full quotes are:

(NYT, Turilli, pp. 4-5)
"The door closed, they went up, and it just seemed a couple seconds and
all of a sudden you just heard like it almost actually that day sounded
like bombs going off, like boom, boom, boom, like seven or eight, and
then just a huge wind gust just came and my officer just actually took
all of us and just threw us down on the ground and kind of just jumped
on top of us, laid on top of us. There were rocks falling and all that.
The lights were still on at that point and all of a sudden the lights
went out and you couldn't see anything."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110501.PDF

(NYT, Carlsen, p. 6)
I guess about three minutes later you just heard explosions coming from
building two, the south tower. It seemed like it took forever, but there
were about ten explosions. At the time I didn't realize what it was. We
realized later after talking and finding out that it was the floors
collapsing to where the plane had hit.
We then realized the building started to come down."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110505.PDF

>>Firefighter Joseph Meola said, "it looked like the building was blowing out
>>on all four sides. We actually heard the pops" (NYT, Meola, p. 5).

"As we are looking up at the building, what I saw was, it looked like
the building was blowing out on all four sides. We actually heard the
pops. Didn't realize it was the falling -- you know, you heard the
pops of the building. You thought it was just blowing out.
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110287.PDF

>>Paramedic Daniel Rivera also mentioned "pops." Asked how he knew that the
>>south tower was coming down, he said: "It was a frigging noise. At first I
>>thought it was---do you ever see professional demolition where they set the
>>charges on certain floors and then you hear 'Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop'? . . .
>>I thought it was that." (NYT, Rivera, p. 9)

"Then that's when -- I kept on walking close to the south tower, and
that's when that building collapsed.
Q. How did you know it was coming down?
A. That noise. It was a noise.
Q. What did you hear? What did you see?
A. It was a frigging noise. At first I thought it was -- do you ever see
professional demolition where they set the charges on certain floors and
then you hear 'Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop'? That's exactly what -- because
I thought it was that. When I heard the frigging noise, that's when I
saw the building coming down."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110035.PDF

>>Timothy Burke said that "the building popped, lower than the fire. . . . I
>>was going oh, my god, there is a secondary device because the way the
>>building popped. I thought it was an explosion" (NYT, Burke, pp. 8-9).

"Then the building popped, lower than the fire, which I learned was I
guess, the aviation fuel fell into the pit, and whatever floor it fell
on heated up really bad and that's why it popped at that floor. That's
the rumor I heard. But it seemed like I was going oh, my god, there is a
secondary device because the way the building popped. I thought it was
an explosion"
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110488.PDF

>>Firefighter Edward Cachia said: "It actually gave at a lower floor, not the
>>floor where the plane hit. . . . [W]e originally had thought there was like
>>an internal detonation, explosives, because it went in succession, boom,
>>boom, boom, boom, and then the tower came down" (NYT, Cachia, p. 5).

"As my officer and I were looking at the south tower, it just gave. It
actually gave at a lower floor, not the floor where the plane hit,
because we originally had thought there was like an internal detonation
explosives because it went in succession, boom, boom, boom, boom, and
then the tower came down"
http://www.nytimes.com/packages/html/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110251.PDF

>>Assistant Commissioner Stephen Gregory said: "I thought . . . before . . .
>>No. 2 came down, that I saw low-level flashes. . . . I . . . saw a flash
>>flash flash . . . [at] the lower level of the building. You know like when
>>they demolish a building?" (NYT, Gregory, pp. 14-16).

We both for whatever reason -- again, I don't know how valid this is
with everything that was going on at that particular point in time, but
for some reason I thought that when I looked in the direction of the
Trade Center before it came down, that I saw low-level flashes. In my
conversation with Lieutenant Evangelista, never mentioning this to him,
he questioned me and asked me if I saw low-level flashes in front of the
building, and I agreed with him because I thought -- at that time I
didn't know what it was. I mean, it could have been a result of the
building collapsing, things exploding, but I saw a flash flash flash and
then it looked like the building came down"
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110008.PDF

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