Activism Discussion: Israel's Indiscriminate Air Strikes - PLUS: The Israeli Voices Washington Doesn't Want You To Hear

Israel's Indiscriminate Air Strikes - PLUS: The Israeli Voices Washington Doesn't Want You To Hear
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EconomicDemocracy Coop
2007-09-06 09:42:30 EST
A human rights group has accused Israel of carrying out indiscriminate
air strikes that killed hundreds of civilians during the 2006 Lebanon
war.

Human Rights Watch said Israel showed "reckless indifference" to the
fate of civilians and queried its argument that Hezbollah used them as
human shields.

A spokesman for the Israeli government insisted its forces had acted
lawfully.

More than 1,125 Lebanese died during the 34-day conflict, as well as
119 Israeli soldiers and 40 civilians.

Last week, the New-York based group criticised Hezbollah for
"indiscriminately and at times deliberately" attacking Israeli
civilians.

It also said the Shia movement had failed to take precautions to spare
civilians during the conflict when it fired rockets from populated
areas and deployed its forces in residential areas.

'Deliberate campaign'

In its 249-page report, Why They Died: Civilian Casualties in Lebanon
during the 2006 War, HRW said it had spent five months investigating
the deaths of 510 civilians and 51 fighters.

At least 300 of the deaths investigated were of women and children,
the group said. [not that killing a man is a 'less of a crime' than
killing a woman... -ED]

HRW said a simple movement by a civilian, such as going out to buy
bread, was often enough to cause an Israeli air strike, even when
there was no evidence of Hezbollah fighters in the vicinity.

Israeli warplanes also targeted many moving vehicles that turned out
to be carrying only civilians trying to flee the conflict, it added.

"Hezbollah fighters often didn't carry their weapons in the open or
regularly wear military uniforms, which made them a hard target to
identify," HRW executive director Kenneth Roth said.

"But this doesn't justify the Israel Defence Force's failure to
distinguish between civilians and combatants, and if in doubt to treat
a person as a civilian, as the laws of war require."

HRW also said the Israeli military repeatedly failed to take into
account the presence of civilians when it targeted Hezbollah, despite
numerous media reports and Israel's own experience of past conflicts.

"Israel wrongfully acted as if all civilians had heeded its warnings
to evacuate southern Lebanon when it knew they had not, disregarding
its continuing legal duty to distinguish between military targets and
civilians," Mr Roth said.

"Issuing warnings doesn't make indiscriminate attacks lawful."

The report also accused Israel of undertaking a deliberate campaign
against Hezbollah's military wing, the Islamic Resistance, but also
its political and social welfare institutions.

'Accepted norms'

A spokesman for the Israeli Foreign Ministry, Mark Regev, defended his
country's conduct, saying it had acted lawfully.

"We conform with accepted norms in the conduct of military conflict
and we conformed with the accepted norms in the conduct of the rules
of war," he told Reuters. [just an assertion, no
evidence...then on and on and on about accusing Hezbollah of using
human shields...a complate lets-change-the-subject straw man since
it's still the Israeli military's responsibility
not to fire on just anyone who happens to cross the street to buy
bread for their starving
family, and crying 'but they [like we] sometimes use human shields!!"
doesn't change
that one iota -ED]

..The war in Lebanon started with a border incursion by Hezbollah, in
which eight Israeli soldiers were killed and two others kidnapped
[they were soldiers, so you mean "taken hostage"
BBC, which is probably the word you'd use in most other situations
where soldiers are "captured" or "taken hostage" ED]...http://
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6981557.stm and
with 2 soldiers taken hostage, clearly bombing the living bezeezuz out
of 20? 200? 2,000?
or more civilians living in civilian areas was "the only thing Israel
could possibly do", yeah, right,
this kind of nonsense isn't just wrong and unfair to non-Israeli
civilians, it's also
harmful, deeply destructive and harmful to Israel itself to engage in
that kind
of insanity, so anyone claiming to 'support israel' would roundly
condemn it
and the usual "we are pro-isreal" mentality is again revealed to be
anything
but pro-israel but in fact pro "keeping Israel militarized as a base
for
Washington" even when its destroying the country for Israelis, the
majority of
whom want peace but are manipulated by their government (just like
here
in the US) into (often) supporting or at least tolerating insane
militarism
by that government, even when it slashes social spending etc etc.

The Israeli voices Washington doesn't want us to hear: Gush Shalom,
the Israeli "Peace Block"

http://gush-shalom.org/english/intro.html

And one of the biggest lies, Barak's "generous offer" exposed by Gush
Shalom:

http://www.gush-shalom.org/media/barak_eng.swf

Pass this page to everyone you know who belies the nonsense about
"but the Palestinians got a generous offer and turned it down!"

++++++++++++=

OUR OWN GOOD

Next week
The occupation will be
40 years old -
More than two thirds
Of the life of Israel.

Every year of occupation
Causes the state
To be more corrupt and sleazy,
More cruel towards the occupied,
More callous towards the occupiers.

The occupation must end -
For our own good,
And not only for the sake
Of the Palestinians.

For information about the many protest actions commemorating 40 years
of occupation see - http://www.kibush40.org

Ad published in Haaretz, June 1, 2007

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/weekly_ad/1180657709

=========

Just like in the US, you have in Israel much higher percentages of
citizens
in favor of sane policies than the actions of the government:

===========

The Majority Wants an Agreement -The Government Does the Opposite

A public opinion poll conducted by "New Wave Research" discloses:

49.2% are for simultaneous negotiations with Mahmoud Abbas and Syria.

66.0% for negotiations with Mahmoud Abbas.

57.4% for contacts with Hamas.

50.1% for almost complete withdrawal to the Green Line.

52.0% for a demilitarized Palestinian state.

62.7% do not believe Olmert can do it.

Ad published in Haaretz, July 13, 2007

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/weekly_ad/1184280939

MURDER

The boy Khalil Sha'er
Was waiting for a bus
Near Tekoa,
When he was seized
And beaten to death
By five soldiers.

Almost every day
In the West Bank and Gaza
The army kills
Children, women
And other unarmed people.
A matter of routine.

While Olmert babbles
About peace,
The occupation is getting
More and more
Deadly, destructive
And rapacious.

Ad published in Haaretz, August 17, 2007

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/weekly_ad/1187367744

Stolen land

Most buyers
Of apartments
>From the failed
Heftsiba company
In Matitiyahu, Har Homa
And Ma'aleh Adumim
Knew that they
Are being built
On stolen land.

What right
Do they have
To complain?

Ad published in Haaretz, August 10, 2007

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/weekly_ad/1186749961
==================

Israel's newspapers to their credit publish this -- if you want to
publish
something like this in the US, good luck to you, you'll be called
nasty names, never mind that Israelis themselves write the above
and get it published in Israeli newspapers. But Washington
wants its military control via Israel, and is much more paranoid about
letting that much dissent into newspapers. Sure the Israel lobby has
power -- because Washington likes it and supports the most
militarist policies it can get an Israeli government to run, even
over objections of the majority of Israelis. Support Israel for real:
stop
supporting its government. Support Saudi Arabia's people for real:
stop
supporting the elite dictatorship running Saudi Arabia. And so forth.
Supporting the people means one thing, supporting the State regime
is quite another.

Meanwhile you can support Gush Shalom

Video
http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/video

Flash Presentations

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/downloads

Gush Shalom founder Uri Avnery's columns

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/avnery

======

http://gush-shalom.org/english/intro.html


= = = =
STILL FEELING LIKE THE MAINSTREAM U.S. CORPORATE MEDIA
IS GIVING A FULL HONEST PICTURE OF WHAT'S GOING ON?
= = = =


= = = =
Sorry, we cannot read/reply to most usenet posts but welcome email
FOR MORE INFORMATION: http://EconomicDemocracy.org/wtc/ (peace)
http://economicdemocracy.org/eco/climate-summary.html (Climate)
And http://EconomicDemocracy.org/ (general)

** New email: econdemocracy[at]gmail[dot]com


SwampMidget
2007-09-06 09:46:17 EST
"reckless indifference"?
Like firing rockets at school children?


Jgarbuz
2007-09-06 12:23:48 EST

"SwampMidget" <webmaster@101click.com> wrote in message
news:1189086377.827742.112530@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
> "reckless indifference"?
> Like firing rockets at school children?<

Islamic Jihad sends its kids out to get the rocket launchers, and if they
are killed in the
counterattack, then they go straight to paradise as martyrs for Islam. And,
Israel gets the resultant negative propaganda. For the muzzies, getting
their kids killed is a WIN/WIN situation. It's what they have and train
their kids for. And they are open about it. Their "sesame street" program
glorifies martyrdom from an early age.

Israel is going to strike back for every rocket attack, and if their kids
are placed in the crossfire, and the press is negative against Israel, so be
it. Israel is not going to allow itself
to get destroyed just to spare their children and for a good press. The
blood of their children is on their own hands. And Israel should say so out
loud.



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


Theodore Herzl
2007-09-06 14:04:08 EST
On Sep 6, 6:46 am, SwampMidget <webmas...@101click.com> wrote:
> "reckless indifference"?
> Like firing rockets at school children?

>From US supplied Apache Helicopters? Yeah, Israel does that all the
time and has murdered nearly 2,000 children alone since the start of
2000.





Nuke Lalouche Addington
2007-09-06 14:18:23 EST
On Sep 6, 6:46 am, SwampMidget <webmas...@101click.com> wrote:
> "reckless indifference"?
> Like firing rockets at school children?

Whom?

Hezbollah?

And Israel has to be as stupid as the terrorists to win?

What the fuck happened to their brains? ( Rearranged by nanos? No? You
do the rearranging, and no one can beat you? Oh.)

And now, world sympathy has been lost to Israel, and they are seen as
brutal aggressors, instead of victims. The IDF sure did it's job..

They are also seen as complicit Bush's Iraq failure. American men and
women died for Sharon's narcissistic delusions...

Think.


Theodore Herzl
2007-09-06 15:45:21 EST
On Sep 6, 9:23 am, "jgarbuz" <jgar...@netzero.com> wrote:
> "SwampMidget" <webmas...@101click.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1189086377.827742.112530@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
>
> > "reckless indifference"?
> > Like firing rockets at school children?<
>
> Islamic Jihad sends its kids out to get the rocket launchers, and if they
> are killed in the
> counterattack, then they go straight to paradise as martyrs for Islam. And,
> Israel gets the resultant negative propaganda. For the muzzies, getting
> their kids killed is a WIN/WIN situation. It's what they have and train
> their kids for. And they are open about it. Their "sesame street" program
> glorifies martyrdom from an early age.
>
> Israel is going to strike back for every rocket attack, and if their kids
> are placed in the crossfire, and the press is negative against Israel, so be
> it. Israel is not going to allow itself
> to get destroyed just to spare their children and for a good press. The
> blood of their children is on their own hands. And Israel should say so out
> loud.
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com


One thing that is often intentionally overlooked by ZioNazi
propagandists is that while the Palestinians respected a cease fire
for many months, the ZioNazi Reich continued to intentionally target
and slaughter women and children, and it was only after the homicidal
Judeofascist ZioNazis shelled the beaches of Gaza and murdered an
entire family that the retaliatory rocket fire by the Palestinian
freedom fighter were re-deployed. The Judeofascist ZioNazis have
been proven time and time again (most recently in a report by HRW on
Lebanon) to be intentionally targeting innocent civilians with its US
supplied weapons, and by the IDFSS's own admission, its jack booted
Nazi thugs will attack even a 3-year-old if they can get one in their
sights, which they did yesterday when child murdering IDFSS snipers
shot an 8-year-old child in the head in occupied Jenin.





Patriot Games
2007-09-06 18:36:37 EST
"EconomicDemocracy Coop" <econdemocracy@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1189086150.193041.270860@r29g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>A human rights group has accused Israel of carrying out indiscriminate
> air strikes that killed hundreds of civilians during the 2006 Lebanon
> war.

Did the Israelis kill any Jews? No.

Did the Israelis kill any Christians? No.

Did the Israelis ONLY kill evil Muslims? Yes.

Then they were PERFECT air strikes.



Osric
2007-09-06 21:52:35 EST
wanker...



Stan Engel
2007-09-06 22:59:19 EST
"EconomicDemocracy Coop" <econdemocracy@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1189086150.193041.270860@r29g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>A human rights group has accused Israel of carrying out indiscriminate
> air strikes that killed hundreds of civilians during the 2006 Lebanon
> war.

> More than 1,125 Lebanese died during the 34-day conflict, as well as
> 119 Israeli soldiers and 40 civilians.

How many of the 1125 Lebanese were males of military age?

> Last week, the New-York based group criticised Hezbollah for
> "indiscriminately and at times deliberately" attacking Israeli
> civilians.

> It also said the Shia movement had failed to take precautions to spare
> civilians during the conflict when it fired rockets from populated
> areas and deployed its forces in residential areas.

> 'Deliberate campaign'

> In its 249-page report, Why They Died: Civilian Casualties in Lebanon
> during the 2006 War, HRW said it had spent five months investigating
> the deaths of 510 civilians and 51 fighters.

Who made the determination of who was a civilian and who was a fighter? The
answer is Hezbollah.

> At least 300 of the deaths investigated were of women and children,
> the group said. [not that killing a man is a 'less of a crime' than
> killing a woman... -ED]

OK, so exactly how many were women?

> HRW said a simple movement by a civilian, such as going out to buy
> bread, was often enough to cause an Israeli air strike, even when
> there was no evidence of Hezbollah fighters in the vicinity.

At least that's what the residents told the intrepid HRW investigators. I'm
guessing Hezbollah guardians watched the investigators 24 hours per day.

> Israeli warplanes also targeted many moving vehicles that turned out
> to be carrying only civilians trying to flee the conflict, it added.

I guess Israeli warplanes should be able to see through cars. By the way, I
recall the claim that 90% of the population supported Hezbollah. When
convenient they transform into civilians. How convenient.

> "Hezbollah fighters often didn't carry their weapons in the open or
> regularly wear military uniforms, which made them a hard target to
> identify," HRW executive director Kenneth Roth said.
>
> "But this doesn't justify the Israel Defence Force's failure to
> distinguish between civilians and combatants, and if in doubt to treat
> a person as a civilian, as the laws of war require."

Yes it does justify the IDF action. The IDF exists to protect Israeli
citizens and not an enemy population that supports Hezbollah. It's better to
kill an enemy civilian than let some terrorist escape.

> HRW also said the Israeli military repeatedly failed to take into
> account the presence of civilians when it targeted Hezbollah, despite
> numerous media reports and Israel's own experience of past conflicts.

Hezbollah didn't worry about those same civilians. Israel shouldn't worry
either.



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


Defendario
2007-09-06 23:19:14 EST
jgarbuz wrote:
> "SwampMidget" <webmaster@101click.com> wrote in message
> news:1189086377.827742.112530@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
>> "reckless indifference"?
>> Like firing rockets at school children?<
>
> Islamic Jihad sends its kids out to get the rocket launchers,

The US Navy used children as drummer boiz and powder monkeys. So what?

You show me a terrorist, and I'll show you a freedom fighter.

It's all in the POV
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