Activism Discussion: HEBREW HOME At Riverdale Is Running A SCAM!

HEBREW HOME At Riverdale Is Running A SCAM!
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Freedom Man
2011-10-27 13:54:43 EST
The Hebrew Home for the Aged at Riverdale, Bronx, NY is running a false
billing SCAM.

My mother was a resident there, and she passed away over a year ago. I
received in the mail an invoice charging me a total of over $284 for "Net
Available Monthly Income" charges that were allegedly more than the payments
made by Medicare, or whoever was responsible for them.

I NEVER signed anything agreeing to be responsible for these charges, and I
will NOT pay them!

Is false billing like this illegal?
Even if not, it exposes a lack of ethics, to put it mildly!
I would think twice before entrusting this institution with the care of a
loved one!



Joan F \MI\
2011-10-27 14:16:52 EST
Her estate would be responsible for that bill. If you are the Executor of
her estate you are the proper person to receive that bill.

Freedom Man wrote:
| The Hebrew Home for the Aged at Riverdale, Bronx, NY is running a
| false billing SCAM.
|
| My mother was a resident there, and she passed away over a year ago. I
| received in the mail an invoice charging me a total of over $284 for
| "Net Available Monthly Income" charges that were allegedly more than
| the payments made by Medicare, or whoever was responsible for them.
|
| I NEVER signed anything agreeing to be responsible for these charges,
| and I will NOT pay them!
|
| Is false billing like this illegal?
| Even if not, it exposes a lack of ethics, to put it mildly!
| I would think twice before entrusting this institution with the care
| of a loved one!


Freedom Man
2011-10-27 14:31:30 EST
"Joan F (MI)" <jjfahl@removethisameritech.net> wrote in message
news:qcydnUtYzJ6aPTTTnZ2dnUVZ_jOdnZ2d@giganews.com...
> Her estate would be responsible for that bill. If you are the Executor of
> her estate you are the proper person to receive that bill.

I am not the executor, but if that person has not agreed in writing to be
responsible for this alleged debt, the invoice is unenforcable.


> Freedom Man wrote:
> | The Hebrew Home for the Aged at Riverdale, Bronx, NY is running a
> | false billing SCAM.
> |
> | My mother was a resident there, and she passed away over a year ago. I
> | received in the mail an invoice charging me a total of over $284 for
> | "Net Available Monthly Income" charges that were allegedly more than
> | the payments made by Medicare, or whoever was responsible for them.
> |
> | I NEVER signed anything agreeing to be responsible for these charges,
> | and I will NOT pay them!
> |
> | Is false billing like this illegal?
> | Even if not, it exposes a lack of ethics, to put it mildly!
> | I would think twice before entrusting this institution with the care
> | of a loved one!



AndyS
2011-10-27 15:40:31 EST
On Oct 27, 1:31 pm, "Freedom Man" <freespe...@4eva.com> wrote:

> I am not the executor, but if that person has not agreed in writing to be
> responsible for this alleged debt, the invoice is unenforcable.



Andy comments:
You are incorrect. I think that you are not familiar with the
term "executor of the estate"....I will elaborate:

If a person's estate, after death, is left to others, by will or
otherwise, an "executor" is appointed to be responsible for paying
the bills and distributing the remainder.

The executor is not personally responsible for any bills unless
he/she makes a mistake which costs the estate. However, the
executor IS responsible for cataloging the assets of the estate,
reporting them to the probate judge, paying the creditors and bills
from the estate funds, paying any taxes, and distributing those assets
according to
the will..
It is a lot of work, and usually an executor uses attorneys and
accountants to do a lot of the work, and to provide guidance as to
the work they do themselves...

If YOU have not been appointed executor, you don't need to
worry about it. However, if there IS an executor, you need to forward
the nursing home information to that person, so they can handle it....

If there are no funds, or disposable assets in the estate, and
there
are no other people who agreed to be jointly responsible, then the
bills go unpaid.....

So, don't worry. Nobody is going to "go after " you unless you
voluntarily agree to take responsibility.... There is one caveat, tho.
If your mother gave you substantial gifts or transferred funds or
property into your name within a certain time period before applying
for Medicaid, the state can seek to recover those "gifts", since the
assumption is that your mother was trying to get the state to pay
for something and hiding assets from the state in order to qualify....

This gets to be tricky when people try to pull a fast one.......
You can google a lot of the information from the internet.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas

Joan F \MI\
2011-10-27 17:41:50 EST
If that person has agreed to be the Executor he is responsible for paying
the bills of the estate out of the assets of the estate. If there are no
assets, he can't pay.

Freedom Man wrote:
|
| I am not the executor, but if that person has not agreed in writing
| to be responsible for this alleged debt, the invoice is unenforcable.
|
|


S*@schenectady.net
2011-10-27 19:44:44 EST
On Thu, 27 Oct 2011 13:54:43 -0400, "Freedom Man"
<*h@4eva.com> wrote:

>The Hebrew Home for the Aged at Riverdale, Bronx, NY is running
>a false billing SCAM.

This at least is possible. But your posting does not show
that this is so in connection with your mother.

It probably is fair to guess to the contrary that the invoice
sent to you resulted from steps nursing homes in N.Y. recently have
increased in response to a N.Y. state comptroller's audit and other
related investigations to try to remedy what too often has amounted to
something of a scam, namely, nursing homes being overpaid by Medicaid
on behalf of Medicaid subsidized nursing home patient/residents who
had more income or other assets than they reported during some
identified period.

Until that audit, too many nursing homes kept those
overpayments but after its dissemination began to repay those sums to
the state then, when they deemed it appropriate, the nursing homes
turned to the patients for reimbursement of the difference between the
amount the patient owed and what the nursing home had legitimately
been paid.

>My mother was a resident there, and she passed away over a year ago.
>I received in the mail an invoice charging me a total of over $284 for
>"Net Available Monthly Income" charges that were allegedly more than
>the payments made by Medicare, or whoever was responsible for them.

Conceivably the invoice was not sufficiently explanatory. But
how you word your posting suggests that a more likely explanation for
you is that you did not read it carefully or, even if you think you
did, that you do not understand what you read or were not
conscientious enough to ask the billing department of the nursing home
for more of an explanation before accusing it of engaging in a scam.

Whether your mother was a comparatively short term Medicare
subsidized nursing resident after a hospitalization or a long term
Medicaid subsidized nursing home resident, the words "Net Available
Monthly Income" as used in the context of either such nursing home
resident does not refer as you seem to presume to a sum that is "more
than the payments" Medicare or Medicaid makes to the institution.

It results instead from a claim by the nursing home or the
reimbursing agency or both that the patient/resident in question had
income that was "available" to her as defined by the applicable
regulations in an amount greater than she had reported and, as a
result, that there has been an overpayment made to the nursing home on
her behalf which the nursing home was obliged to repay to the state as
administrator of whichever applies of Medicaid or Medicare so that the
patient/resident herself became to pay the nursing home the difference
between the net amount for which it had been reimbursed and the charge
that the patient/resident had agreed, but for a Medicaid or Medicare
subsidy, to pay the nursing home.

>I NEVER signed anything agreeing to be responsible for these charges, and
>I will NOT pay them!

You said that the bill was sent to you in the physical sense
but you do not actually make clear that it demanded payment from you,
individually, make clear what it claimed reason. But if it was an
invoice to you, personally, there could be any number of reasons why
you are not obliged to pay it. One of them could be that you did not
sign any document by which you agreed to be a guarantor for your
mother's obligations.

>Is false billing like this illegal?

False billing is civilly unlawful and, depending on more
details than you post, sometimes a crime. Mistaken billing is a
mistake that might be neither false nor unlawful. And no one can
tell only from what you say so whether the bill mailed to you was
false.

>Even if not, it exposes a lack of ethics, to put it mildly!

It is possible that the mailing of the bill to you resulted in
part from a lack of ethics. It also is possible that it is the
result of a clerical mistake perhaps generated by an inadequately
efficient computerized billing program. And depending on facts that
might exist but which you have not yet posted, it might be a well
justified invoice or a deliberately false one.

>I would think twice before entrusting this institution with the care of a
>loved one!

If you not saying in your posting that you have spoken with
this institution to inquire reflects you having chosen not to do that
before resorting to public accusations of the nursing home engaging in
a false billing SCAM, one would think that your complaint is more than
a little overblown maybe to the point of being unethical.





Freedom Man
2011-10-28 12:45:34 EST
"Joan F (MI)" <jjfahl@removethisameritech.net> wrote in message
news:i_udnbewSsCfTTTTnZ2dnUVZ_rWdnZ2d@giganews.com...
> If that person has agreed to be the Executor he is responsible for paying
> the bills of the estate out of the assets of the estate. If there are no
> assets, he can't pay.
>
> Freedom Man wrote:
> |
> | I am not the executor, but if that person has not agreed in writing
> | to be responsible for this alleged debt, the invoice is unenforcable.

Thank you all for your replies and advice.
There were no remaining assets, so the point is moot.



Jerry Okamura
2011-10-29 15:18:16 EST
Well, I dunno....did they incur that cost?

"Freedom Man" wrote in message news:j8c5t4$86h$1@dont-email.me...

The Hebrew Home for the Aged at Riverdale, Bronx, NY is running a false
billing SCAM.

My mother was a resident there, and she passed away over a year ago. I
received in the mail an invoice charging me a total of over $284 for "Net
Available Monthly Income" charges that were allegedly more than the payments
made by Medicare, or whoever was responsible for them.

I NEVER signed anything agreeing to be responsible for these charges, and I
will NOT pay them!

Is false billing like this illegal?
Even if not, it exposes a lack of ethics, to put it mildly!
I would think twice before entrusting this institution with the care of a
loved one!



David1950
2011-10-30 00:03:15 EST
they're jews they steal from everyone, think you're special?

tell them to fuck off,

that's fuck off, not go fuck their daughters

like the hillbillies do


"Freedom Man" <freespeech@4eva.com> wrote in message
news:j8c5t4$86h$1@dont-email.me...
: The Hebrew Home for the Aged at Riverdale, Bronx, NY is running a false
: billing SCAM.
:
: My mother was a resident there, and she passed away over a year ago. I
: received in the mail an invoice charging me a total of over $284 for "Net
: Available Monthly Income" charges that were allegedly more than the payments
: made by Medicare, or whoever was responsible for them.
:
: I NEVER signed anything agreeing to be responsible for these charges, and I
: will NOT pay them!
:
: Is false billing like this illegal?
: Even if not, it exposes a lack of ethics, to put it mildly!
: I would think twice before entrusting this institution with the care of a
: loved one!
:
:



David1950
2011-10-30 00:04:21 EST
STFU, nobody needs any of that hillbilly logic,ignorance, and stupidity

what have you confederate losers,failures, and fuckups ever done right ??
"AndyS" <jungleandy1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:9ad0d49c-5842-479d-aa12-7ace72ac6c40@g7g2000vbv.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 27, 1:31 pm, "Freedom Man" <freespe...@4eva.com> wrote:

> I am not the executor, but if that person has not agreed in writing to be
> responsible for this alleged debt, the invoice is unenforcable.



Andy comments:
You are incorrect. I think that you are not familiar with the
term "executor of the estate"....I will elaborate:

If a person's estate, after death, is left to others, by will or
otherwise, an "executor" is appointed to be responsible for paying
the bills and distributing the remainder.

The executor is not personally responsible for any bills unless
he/she makes a mistake which costs the estate. However, the
executor IS responsible for cataloging the assets of the estate,
reporting them to the probate judge, paying the creditors and bills
from the estate funds, paying any taxes, and distributing those assets
according to
the will..
It is a lot of work, and usually an executor uses attorneys and
accountants to do a lot of the work, and to provide guidance as to
the work they do themselves...

If YOU have not been appointed executor, you don't need to
worry about it. However, if there IS an executor, you need to forward
the nursing home information to that person, so they can handle it....

If there are no funds, or disposable assets in the estate, and
there
are no other people who agreed to be jointly responsible, then the
bills go unpaid.....

So, don't worry. Nobody is going to "go after " you unless you
voluntarily agree to take responsibility.... There is one caveat, tho.
If your mother gave you substantial gifts or transferred funds or
property into your name within a certain time period before applying
for Medicaid, the state can seek to recover those "gifts", since the
assumption is that your mother was trying to get the state to pay
for something and hiding assets from the state in order to qualify....

This gets to be tricky when people try to pull a fast one.......
You can google a lot of the information from the internet.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas


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