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Eki
2006-05-03 02:31:52 EST

>From wikipedia:

Vedic Sanskrit had a voiceless bilabial fricative (/?/, called
upamadhamiya)

---------------------------------

Shouldn't that be "upadhmaaniiya"?




Nikolaj
2006-05-03 04:38:33 EST
eki wrote:

> From wikipedia:
>
> Vedic Sanskrit had a voiceless bilabial fricative (/?/, called
> upamadhamiya)
>
> ---------------------------------
>
> Shouldn't that be "upadhmaaniiya"?


Yes.

Is upadhmAnIya a 'voiceless bilabial fricative'? What the heck is that,
and how does it differ from normal visarjanIya (voicles apiration) Hm,
would that be voicless velar fricative?

Eki
2006-05-03 08:23:53 EST
Wed, 03 May 2006 10:38:33 +0200, Nikolaj <nikolaj.korbar@bla.si> a
écrit:

>eki wrote:
>
>> From wikipedia:
>>
>> Vedic Sanskrit had a voiceless bilabial fricative (/?/, called
>> upamadhamiya)
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>>
>> Shouldn't that be "upadhmaaniiya"?
>
>
>Yes.
>
>Is upadhmAnIya a 'voiceless bilabial fricative'? What the heck is that,
>and how does it differ from normal visarjanIya (voicles apiration) Hm,
>would that be voicless velar fricative?

Perhaps it should be 'labiodental fricative' [ f ]. I think that's
how Vedic pandits pronounce 'H' before a 'p' or 'ph'.

Xxxvvi
2006-05-03 21:27:27 EST
This q. I have asked several years ago. Ancient Indians seem to prefer
aspirates & similar sounds. Even 's' is changed into asp.s.
-----------
Revision of "Re: a a" -

It's really an interesting topic. The Chn. name of mah-abharata is:
muo hY puo luo duo


Nikolaj
2006-05-04 03:08:39 EST
eki wrote:

>>Is upadhmAnIya a 'voiceless bilabial fricative'? What the heck is that,
>>and how does it differ from normal visarjanIya (voicles apiration) Hm,
>>would that be voicless velar fricative?
>
>
> Perhaps it should be 'labiodental fricative' [ f ]. I think that's
> how Vedic pandits pronounce 'H' before a 'p' or 'ph'.

Yes, I know that in theory. Do you have some recitation where one could
hear it?

Eki
2006-05-05 05:47:46 EST
Thu, 04 May 2006 09:08:39 +0200, Nikolaj <nikolaj.korbar@bla.si> a
écrit:

>eki wrote:
>
>>>Is upadhmAnIya a 'voiceless bilabial fricative'? What the heck is that,
>>>and how does it differ from normal visarjanIya (voicles apiration) Hm,
>>>would that be voicless velar fricative?
>>
>>
>> Perhaps it should be 'labiodental fricative' [ f ]. I think that's
>> how Vedic pandits pronounce 'H' before a 'p' or 'ph'.
>
>Yes, I know that in theory. Do you have some recitation where one could
>hear it?

For instance in Giitaa I 12 , on the "Movement" tapes, the second
line "kuru-vRddhaH pitaa-mahaH" sounds to me like "kuru-vRddhaf
pitaa-mahahaa".

Nikolaj
2006-05-08 08:19:55 EST
eki wrote:

> Thu, 04 May 2006 09:08:39 +0200, Nikolaj <nikolaj.korbar@bla.si> a
> écrit:
>
>>eki wrote:
>>
>>>>Is upadhmAnIya a 'voiceless bilabial fricative'? What the heck is that,
>>>>and how does it differ from normal visarjanIya (voicles apiration) Hm,
>>>>would that be voicless velar fricative?
>>>
>>>
>>>Perhaps it should be 'labiodental fricative' [ f ]. I think that's
>>>how Vedic pandits pronounce 'H' before a 'p' or 'ph'.
>>
>>Yes, I know that in theory. Do you have some recitation where one could
>>hear it?
>
> For instance in Giitaa I 12 , on the "Movement" tapes, the second
> line "kuru-vRddhaH pitaa-mahaH" sounds to me like "kuru-vRddhaf
> pitaa-mahahaa".

I checked, and indeed it sounds like an 'f'. Only that gItA is not in
Vedic, or? Interesting, thanks.

BTW: If you are still interested in comprehensive Sanskrit grammars: I
ordered Whitney's Sanskrit Grammar and it is the most comprehensive I
have seen up to now.

Eki
2006-05-08 10:35:56 EST
Mon, 08 May 2006 14:19:55 +0200, Nikolaj <nikolaj.korbar@bla.si> a
écrit:

>eki wrote:
>
>> Thu, 04 May 2006 09:08:39 +0200, Nikolaj <nikolaj.korbar@bla.si> a
>> écrit:
>>
>>>eki wrote:
>>>
>>>>>Is upadhmAnIya a 'voiceless bilabial fricative'? What the heck is that,
>>>>>and how does it differ from normal visarjanIya (voicles apiration) Hm,
>>>>>would that be voicless velar fricative?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Perhaps it should be 'labiodental fricative' [ f ]. I think that's
>>>>how Vedic pandits pronounce 'H' before a 'p' or 'ph'.
>>>
>>>Yes, I know that in theory. Do you have some recitation where one could
>>>hear it?
>>
>> For instance in Giitaa I 12 , on the "Movement" tapes, the second
>> line "kuru-vRddhaH pitaa-mahaH" sounds to me like "kuru-vRddhaf
>> pitaa-mahahaa".
>
>I checked, and indeed it sounds like an 'f'. Only that gItA is not in
>Vedic, or? Interesting, thanks.
>
>BTW: If you are still interested in comprehensive Sanskrit grammars: I
>ordered Whitney's Sanskrit Grammar and it is the most comprehensive I
>have seen up to now.

Well, as it happens, I did that, too. : )

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